LoL 2013 Champion Tier List - Solo Queue - Patch 3.10 Updated August #2 | NERFPLZ.LOL

Aug 24, 2013

2013 Champion Tier List - Solo Queue - Patch 3.10 Updated August #2


Preface Chatter
Earlier this week, I decided to go on a solo queue grind marathon playing mostly mid and support, since I saw that was where most people had some differences in opinion just to make sure I had things on track...

So after about 20 hours of solo queue power hour grinding in the past week, I've decided to revamp the tier list a bit, enough so that it deserves a second edition instead of some sneaky ninja edits. Since there hasn't been an actual patch update yet (which usually occurs magically right after I update the tier list), I haven't added in a patch change list below (they're still available here). Anyway, without further adieu, version 2.0!

Summary of Changes:

  • Lots of movement in the support and mid laning area. A lot of nerfs and buffs have hit mid lane lately, and I've been a big stubborn on movement since I try and avoid big sweeping changes to the list. However, this time I decided to do a lot at once.
  • Added Lucian to the list.
  • Fiddled with the junglers a bit, but for the most part it's very similar.
  • Top Lane barely changed.
  • ADC still status quo, a couple shifts around in Tier 1.
The Tier List

God Tier: 
Mid-Lane GodsKassadin
Jungle GodsRammus, Zac, Amumu, Jarvan IV, Fiddlesticks, Sejuani
AD Gods
Top Lane GodsSingedWukong
Support Gods:  SonaZyra, Janna, Thresh,

Tier 1:
Mid-LaneZyra, Ahri, Kennen, Malzahar, Twisted Fate, Diana, Lux, Brand, Kayle, Fizz, Lissandra, Morgana, Kha'ZixNidalee
JungleMaster Yi,  Nasus, Hecarim, Cho'Gath, Evelynn, Nautilus, Lee Sin, Elise, Volibear, Maokai,
AD Carry: Caitlyn, Vayne, Varus, Graves, Tristana, Twitch, Miss Fortune, Ezreal, Kog'Maw, Ashe, Draven, Corki, Quinn
Top Lane: Tryndamere, Master Yi, Kennen, Renekton, Yorick, Elise, Jayce, Jarvan IV, Nidalee, Jax, Irelia, Zac, Riven, Lee Sin, Udyr
Support: Nami, Leona, Blitzcrank

Tier 2:
Mid-LaneJayce, Elise, Annie, Orianna, Mordekaiser, Vladimir, Anivia, Zed, Viktor, Cho'Gath, Swain, Xerath, Katarina, Evelynn, Karthus, Ryze, Akali, Talon, Galio, Gragas
JungleNocturne, Shyvana, Udyr, Aatrox, Vi, Nunu, Kha'Zix, Shen, Warwick, Malphite, Leona, Shaco, Trundle, Xin Zhao, Rengar, Skarner, Diana, Zed
AD Carry:  Lucian, Sivir
Top Lane: Kayle, Rumble, Rengar, Swain, Teemo, Aatrox, Kha'Zix, Vladimir, Nasus, Shen, Gangplank, Cho'gath, Darius, Volibear, Garen, Zed, Malphite
Support: Lulu, Taric, Alistar, Soraka

Tier 3:
Mid-LanePantheon, Cassiopeia, Syndra, Veigar, Sion, Ziggs, Fiddlesticks
JungleFiora, Riven, Pantheon, Dr. Mundo, Jax, Kayle, Darius
AD Carry:
Top Lane: Fiora, Shyvana, Warwick, Xin Zhao, Ryze, Nunu, Pantheon, Akali, Galio, Talon, Trundle, Dr. Mundo, Poppy
Support: Fiddlesticks, Morgana, Nunu, Lux, Nautilus, Shen, Nidalee

Tier 4:
Mid-Lane Lulu, Karma, Kog'maw, Zilean, Leblanc, Soraka, Tristana, Janna, Ezreal, Heimerdinger
JungleTryndamere, Olaf, Gangplank, Blitzcrank, Alistar
AD Carry: Urgot
Top Lane: Urgot, Olaf
Support: Kayle, Malphite, Gangplank, Elise, Maokai, Yorick, Lissandra, Karma, Ashe, Zilean, Leblanc, Caitlyn

  • Champions in BOLD I will talk about shortly
  • Champions in Italics may be over/undervalued, but aren't/haven't played enough for me to make a better judgement.
  • Within each tier the champions are strongest from left to right, but within a tier each champion's strength is relatively close. This is especially true for Tiers 2 and 3 where these champions are ALL highly playable and player dependent on how strong they are in-game.

Champion Explanations
  • Ahri - Ahri's very strong right now as many of her assassin counters have either been nerfed or gone out of style. She still needs to watch out for Kassadin, but as her wave push is way better and her roaming/burst damage is comparable if not better, she can definitely hold her own on the field.
  • Ashe - Moving Ashe up because of her combo with Zyra. It's some next level bull**** brought to you courtesy of C9. Never let the enemy team get this combo...
  • Fizz - I've said before that Fizz is a bit useless if he doesn't get ahead, and it still holds true. However, with FOTM mids being all skillshot and or burst champions (Ryze went bye bye), Fizz is extremely strong in the field if he can mindgame hard enough.
  • Kha'Zix - I can't base it off of the regular play of Kha'zix, but for those that understand that they need the reset, Kha'zix is easily one of the most obnoxious carries in the game, especially when tanks decide to build no damage. It's far too easy to kill a squishy and jump away from the peeler to the next squishy.
  • Lissandra - Lissandra...oh Lissandra. I'm still having a tough time coming to terms with her, since I'm still biased, but her kit is amazing, and with blue buff she definitely spams enough to be a nuisance in lane. She's got good initiation and her waveclear is excellent. I still think she's weaker than she appears in game though...possibly because all the mid champions I play counter her. Once she gets ahead though, there's almost no escape, as her combo is similar to Fiddle/Sejuani/Amumu as she can initiate over walls to a massive AOE.
  • Lucian - Lucian's damage output is insane, but his skillcap seems a bit high. I've also never seen a Lucian win any case, I think that in time he'll move up to Tier 1 due to him having a decent kit, but he's definitely no release Graves (e.g. 75% win rate on release date)
  • Master Yi - Master Yi is definitely really good, but requires experience to be good at. As a glass cannon, the urge is strong to rush in and snowball off kills. However, for the same reasons he's not quite God Tier, as once he gives Jarvan his kill streak, things turn sour from there. With Blade of the Ruined King + Randuins he's definitely still a major force to be reckoned with and I ban him out of habit, but I really think he's managable.
  • Morgana - Morgana's been moved up to Tier 1 simply because  many teamfights are turning to more poke wars instead of hard engages (usually for fear of counter engages). As a result, Morgana, with one of the strongest low CD CCs in the game combined with her hard AOE engage on her ultimate, is extremely strong right now with all her counters nerfed.
  • Nidalee - Nidalee, like Morgana makes it just a matter of time before the enemy team is low enough for your team to hard engage on them. The fact that she can blow up an enemy squshy in 2 hits late game no matter how much gold she has is a little game-breaking. Of course, with good dodging skills this can be avoided...
  • Rammus - Rammus is just simply too fast. Can you beat sonic the hedgehog? I've mentioned how homeguard and boots of mobility make him broken many times before, but seriously, it really is broken...his status are actually fairly strong, and his clear time average, which means that he starts his rampage sooner than enemy teams can prepare to deal with it.
  • Singed - I'm not sure why I'm talking about singed right now, as he's been at the top of god tier for a while, but basically the whole tear + rylai + randuins build is more than a little annoying, and somehow more frustrating than RoA + Rylai. I'd also like to add that the whole proxy Singed does work very well by pulling the enemy mid/jungler to help as long as the top laner doesn't have enough CC to stop him. However, it requires very good map awareness.
  • Sona - Sona is arguably the strongest solo queue support in the game right now simply because she does more damage than all the rest of them save Zyra. Her AOE CC is also very easy to land with an absurd range. As Riot's mentioned before, they're not sure why they gave a support a huge AOE least they brough out Zyra and Nami to compensate!
  • Taric - With Sona and Zyra doing so much damage at the moment, Taric has a bit of trouble keeping up unless he outplays. He's still viable, but it does take a lot more effort to play him effectively, since unlike Sona, you'll actually need to use your hands.
  • Zac - Zac jungle is still ridiculously powerful even with the nerfs. His top lane is also very good at the moment, and giving good results. I was a bit too hasty with moving him down.
  • Zyra - Support Zyra is very powerful right now, but if someone wants to play her mid I suggest giving it up and switching to Sona. Her combination with Ashe almost guarantees an early flash/first blood. The fact that she has an AOE snare as well as a huge AOE engage/disengage ability also gives her a ton of utility. 
  • The purpose of this list is for discussion and to provide a starting point for hero selection.
Agree? Disagree? Comment below!

First time to Nerfplz.Lol or not sure where to find everything? Try the Site Map


  1. ShadowSectAugust 24, 2013

    Want me to make yet another list for where champions have been moved from?

  2. Henry YoungAugust 24, 2013

    Yes Ahri, my main!! Actually you can outplay Kass with Ahri. Since that Kass is simple but aggressive (like Taric), you can just E Kass when he ults in to Q or do some damage, and always win the trade or even picking up a kill.

  3. what about cassiopeia ? i think her quite strong with the most powerfull lvl 2 of an ap caster

  4. SSJSuntasticAugust 24, 2013

    Hi Shadow, only if you really want to haha.

  5. Like I said last week, Fiora gives more to a team, hence why her winrate is a whole tier higher.

    Aside from that, she can 1v1 almost any champion, she can win trade offs easier thanks to her passive and parry, and she has insane early game damage, and then she swoops back in for late game assassin burst.

    Not to mention, an untargatable ult that can punish enemies for focusing her, being that she regains a large amount of health back while damaging the allies.

    And yes, I am a huge Fiora fan.

    If you want to put Yi in tier one, why isn't Fiora there? She can split push even better than Yi if she gets a Hydra, because she gets one of the best attack speed buffs in the game.

    also, why is Vlad so high and Karma so low? Karma's win rate is up a bit and she doesn't have as bad a late game as other mages. Not to mention you don't have Karma top on there, which is one of the tops i've come to understand as really good?

    and isn't Irelia a bit high? Tier 1?

    Move ups: Fiora(top), Karma(mid), Lulu, Mundo (jungle), Karma (top), Volibear (top), Vi (top),
    Move downs: Tryn, Yi, Vlad, Twisted Fate, Riven (jungle), Udyr (top)


  6. in a ahri vs kassadin the cod player wins (100 hours of training in reflexes is some serious sht)

  7. imo lissandra should be tier 2. her laning is horrible as heck and the only good thing of her is the late game because of her kit. and imo Lux should be god tier because she can win lost games also she is an amazing AOE mdmg dealer and can push quite easily, and mordekaiser tier 1 cos if he gets some kills he can stay on mid lane forever.

  8. Despite being a bit weak on the skill department, Lucian is an insanely mobile ADC. I played 5 games with him (3 normal, 2 solo q ranked) and still haven't lost with him, in every game getting from 6 to 14 kills.
    Passive is also really strong, and procing it will make you deal tons of damage. I'm loving him, may need a little buff on Q and W damage and maybe lower the mana costs or increas his mana pool, but he's definitely Tier 1 material.

  9. SSJSuntasticAugust 25, 2013

    Hi WindAeris, you're really pushing for that Fiora Karma aren't you? It's really tough to sell me on Karma, since although she's a fun champion to play, in a 5v5 she loses a lot of luster since a lot of her abilities are great against melee champions, but gets shredded from ADC fire due to her low range.

    A lot of the other move ups you jotted down are seldom played, so it's difficult for me to simply move them up on a whim.

    I agree that Udyr top and Riven jungle may be moved down a bit in the future. Riven's getting a major overhaul though, so I may leave her be for now.

    I do appreciate you constantly bringing champions to my attention though! :)

  10. The problem with Fiora is the same with every melee adc, once she goes in, she's dead. She has no way to get out once she's all-in, that's her problem, same goes for current Rengar.
    Yi has resets, anti-slow ultimate, Kha has resets too, Lee can get in and out of trouble easily, Wukong has a neat 1.5 sec invisible, and Tryndamere 6 sec immortality and Aatrox has a similar help.
    This is the sole reason why Fiora isn't as good as others. Sure, she can 1v1 anyone and win, split push like a queen, but there are better picks.

  11. When you're lanes suck, Jarvan can carry and save the day. Not sure you get that out of the other god tier guys. And a tanky Jarvan with armor pen is scary. Even a snowballed Jarvan who ganks la and double kills

  12. Rammus, Zac, Amumu and J4 are just too strong atm. J4 is completely stupid atm.

  13. Oh Yeah! I knew Kha was Tier 1 Material :D

  14. Oh and Umm. Is Diana Or Fizz better? I've tried fizz for a while during free weeks. I can say I'm good with him , But should I get Diana (Never tried her yet)?

  15. I think Morgana's is too well placed, yes, if you get the bind, it is all over, but if you don't, it is all over for you.
    I try to love Morgana but she is just not very reliable, at all.
    even her creep clear isn't that good sometimes (when it should be)

  16. From the way I see Lux, Tier 1 is too MUCH. Tier 2 Is better. I Agree with the lissandra though. Mordekaiser, Tier 1 is quite much for him cuz his late game is too stronk.

  17. stealthwar42August 25, 2013

    Major overhaul? Where'd you see this? Can't find it anywhere on the webs.

  18. I know, and like I said - Fiora has her ult as resets on her E.

    This means if she keeps killing, her self buffs are constant and better than Yi's.
    She also has ult when she gets low, which is being changed so its unable to be canceled.

    And I'm only pushing for Karma changes because Karma top is so strong right now. After that she just becomes a Sheruylas and AoE poke machine. But with a win-rate higher than Twisted Fate how bad can she be?

  19. Haven't tried Karma mid or top, I played her support a few times and the zoning with Q is insane, plus the shield with that movement speed buff sets up the kills very well, she is subpar compared to other supports, but not half bad

  20. PhantomSVKAugust 25, 2013

    I dont think that Ryze is more for team as Cassiopeia in middle lane.

  21. SSJSuntasticAugust 25, 2013

    Her q is getting some changes, check it out here

  22. stealthwar42August 25, 2013

    But that's it, right? Just the fact that her Q ends in getting knocked up (sts) instead of pushed back? The world "overhaul" had me panicked, thought I was going to have to relearn my girl from scratch.

  23. SSJSuntasticAugust 25, 2013

    Haha sorry if I startled you. Her play style should be the same, but her utility should be going up.

  24. You completely left off Yorick (except support). Great list though!

  25. SSJSuntasticAugust 25, 2013

    Hi xavier he's in t1 top Lane :) Thanks!

  26. Please do :3

  27. Hey, I have a friend who is a huge Nami fan. Can you give a good statement as to why she is tier 1 and not in god tier?

  28. Isidro CruzAugust 25, 2013

    Lucian is going straight on to the tier 7, more likely to the tier 1.

  29. Might wanna give top lane Quinn a shot. I've seen a few people around do it, I do it myself pretty often, and it usually goes very well.

  30. Im a nami player. And as support main role player I can understand when nami is strong.

    First of all the CD on nami don't let her stay in prolonged engagements this issue left her with 2 choices identify when you use your CD in large fights or blow all the CD in a short one and pray your team can manage the fight until you can regain your CD.

  31. Why SSJSuntastic? Why have u done this to Rammus? Owning with him since homeguard as been relased and now, next patch i can say by by to my 6 KDA with rammus in 70 games :/

    Plz Riot dont nerf my armordillo :D

  32. So nami isn't as versatile as sona janna zyra or thresh. Nami needs a team who can work with her. She fits in "wombocombo" comps or sierge comps due his W also she goes worst as the game go late due his kit is designed to lanning and little skirmish no straight big fights.

    Hid kit seems good in the new PICK comps who rellies in little skirmish and catch outout of place.
    She is not tier 1 or god tier due because she relies too much in team comps and his lanning strength but is a good champ over all

  33. invencibeLAugust 25, 2013

    Hello can you explain me how this works please? What are those tiers? Why some champs are "gods" ? Sorry for my ignorance. Thank you.

  34. Diana is the love of my life. I main mid, and I can say that I would recommend Diana.... More on my reasons later....

  35. Nick CucinelliAugust 25, 2013

    I commented on your other post but you addresed alot of the issues so:

    How is J4 that good. I play him alot and i perfer Sejuani honostly. He doesnt bring as much CC and tank to the table, although a bit more damage. Usually i build him full tank, vs sejuani full tank, he doesnt do it for me.

    Can someone explain why he is that great?

  36. So, I must ask.

    Do you plan on moving Fiora up? At least to Tier 2?

  37. Andres SillerAugust 25, 2013

    My friend believes Urgot should be God Tier. Explain to him why he's wrong AND gay.

  38. Vendenlor IkariAugust 25, 2013

    The amount of utility a j4 brings is honestly really unmatched.
    Yes sej can bring more cc in the long run but j4 has two group cc.
    Not only that but the fact that standard acts as a psuedo ward can save so many teams.
    Plus a pre six gank by j4 are scary and j4 hits a powerspike around 7-12 so yeah

  39. Vendenlor IkariAugust 25, 2013

    both are good but dianna can alot of different build paths that can still del huge amounts of dmg. as a fizz like ssj said b4 if your dont kill a squishy your a sitting duck with cooldowns

  40. Nocturne isn't a Tier 1 Jungle?

  41. Could you please compile the bold explanations from earlier versions somewhere? I missed one or two of these, and if champions previously had an explanation for where they were, and they are still in the same spot, I'd like to see it.

  42. João Victor C. MazzeiAugust 26, 2013

    Then I guess you should get the bind to hit more often. If for you, your Q isn't reliable, max your W first.

  43. Addison T. SmithAugust 26, 2013

    Cough cough Nautilius cough cough

  44. He get outdamaged easly mid/late game put him against a vayne or draven he will feel it...

  45. Easly kited like Udyr...and you going to tell me "but bro! his ult!!!" sure agree with you he is ahead from udyr mostly for that :)

  46. Read description plz...

    God Tier: These champions are almost impossible to keep down. If your team doesn't make it a priority to shut down these champions and shut them down hard, even if they lose their lane, lose in CS, and it's their first time playing the champion, they can be a massive nuisance for your team. On the other hand, if they're actually good at the champion...that's when it's time to throw in the towel.

  47. BTW SSJ i think its time to take fiddle out of God Jungler...Tier 1 ok but not god :/

  48. True, is utility is unmatched. He just brings so much to with table with his great CC (slow, knock up, trap) and his aurora steriod and armor pen but maybe the biggest thing is how he can build incredibly tanky and still have very respectable dps.

  49. I reckon LeBlanc should be higher up the tier list, as she has incredible damage if played correctly despite her almost complete lack in pushing power.

  50. Urgot is an incredibly annoying champ and will win any trade any day

  51. But she is in tier 1 .-.

  52. Nicolas CageAugust 26, 2013

    Massively skill-reliant champion that becomes useless late-game if not ahead.

    That said, she does have a lot of early and mid game damage. I'd move her up to the bottom of Tier 3, I suppose.

  53. I don't understand why wukong is god tier top. Yeah he's 5th highest win rate ATM, but is far too easily shut down pre 6. Zac definitely deserves his place in god tier top. You cant kill him, you cant out-sustain him and you most definitely cannot get away from him.

  54. Karl Edward BayronAugust 27, 2013

    Nautilus has to have a safe jungling phase to be be successful and he's slow but Jarvan has decent clear speed. Can easily come back from being down and fit many team comps.

  55. Lionel AlmaidaAugust 27, 2013

    How to counter a Zac: Walk over his boogerlings. That's all.

  56. Lionel AlmaidaAugust 27, 2013

    The LB nerf rip off her awesome poke-harrass-ownage power. Only if you know her very well you can play without feel her diminished.-

  57. Lionel AlmaidaAugust 27, 2013

    J4 is the bomb. He's my #1 jungler. A lot of times the other team jokes about J4 is carrying the game alone, 'cause even when you go tankier still killing easily due to your passive. And in top lane, he's a pain in the ass.

  58. Matt MellorsAugust 27, 2013

    Please keep this updated! I love using it.

  59. kisamefishfryAugust 27, 2013

    smiteless hecarim jungle is op. Revive and ghost makes for a horrifying tank that will torment the enemy team.

  60. nipslipperAugust 28, 2013

    You should take a look at corki. Highest winrate of any ADC at the moment.

  61. grandredfishthe1stAugust 28, 2013

    I think you might want to consider moving jun Udyr, well only if their smart enough to play him as Phoenix Udyr

  62. Julien JaminAugust 28, 2013

    Where's Wukong midlane ? Give it a try and tell me what you think about it.

  63. Why Tier 3 Pantheon? I feel he is between tier 1/2.

  64. Nick CucinelliAugust 28, 2013

    Yeah i agree with that i underrated his passive a bit.

    I think my problem is i perfer late game junglers like Sejuani, (really love sejuani) and jarven late game really cant offer much unless you get a good ulti, i assume he is also a skill based and know how character (when and how to land ult) and that may be my problem aswrll

  65. In this light.. I hear more and more people saying AP corki is more viable than AD corki at this moment.
    Care to include him / share some light on him?

  66. Jack SparrowAugust 28, 2013

    3.10a please

  67. Vendenlor IkariAugust 28, 2013

    i dont think hes easy to shut down pre six a simple e aa q combo and w are simple harras and allow you to survive till six. Plus that doesn't change the fact even if you shut him down a group aoe knockup is still useful no matter what. The monkey is very powerful

  68. Kha'Zix in my opinion is tier 1 jungler right now. Fast clear, 45% slow at level 3, disengage and engage after 11 lvl(because evolving spikes is pointless), level 6 ganks are godlike and dmg is overpowering,

  69. In my opinion Kha'Zix is tier 1 jungle. Fast clear, 45% slow with even 1 point on w(as a jungler passive is always active), damage with q is overpowering and hitting level 6 makes slow is so extended that its really hard to escape him. Also evolved wings are strong disengage.

  70. Just always max W, then creep kills are easy, you have life sustain with the W, and the spell shield is OP against ganks. So basically morgana is one of the safest laners by far, and late game team fights she is amazing. Also if the jungler comes mid, you can get him to lure the mid to a bind, and with the junglers help that should be a free kill for you.

  71. Max HospadarukAugust 29, 2013

    you unknowingly hit the head on the nail: J4's ult is beyond powerful, but the skillcap is extremely high. So easy to waste, and even worse, to hinder your team. but perfectly used, it can make his team impossible to beat, regardless of how much tenacity they stack or QSSs they build :D

  72. Lissandra is easily even with Lux if not better. I never lost a lane against Lux with Lissandra. Her pushing potential is way higher than Lux with her Q. Lux her skill shots are easily provoked and renders her venerable for an initiate/gank. Hitting level 6 with Lissandra + ignite is almost a guaranteed kill on mid. Also IF you were to lose your lane, you can easily push her back to the tower and pick up a kill on bot/top lane due to Lissandra's amazing ganking potential.

    Mordekaiser tier 2 is just fine. He gets outplayed big time on top and he definitely isn't the best pick for mid either.

  73. Nick CucinelliAugust 29, 2013

    Maybe i did it knowingly? The world may never know.

  74. Hy guys!
    I really like your tier list, good job with it! Still, there is one point where I don't aggree with you. Nautilus, as a support. I know most players prefer him as a jungler, also you stated that from tier1 to tier3 every champion is playable and depends on the player skill. Still, I'd like you to consider placing him in a higher tier, as he is better than the ones in tier 3 like Nid for example. I think he is much better. He has so much utility, and sustain to help the adc on bot. He can pull, stun with each basic attack on different enemies thanks to his passive, he has aoe slow, a well-scaling shield, and a really good ulti. He is my main support, and I carried lots of laning phases, or even games with him. He is naturally tanky, so he can just build support and still be strong. Also items like ruby sightstone are great on him as his shield scales with his maximum hp.
    Many times I saved my adc when both the enemy jungler and mid came to gank us, and it was 2v4. I could stun every one of them, slow them, and send my ulti on the one, who tried to chase my carry. Also, he can still push, if needed, for example to save a turret, from minion waves, or just push in late game.
    I find him a great support, and I think he deserves to be in like tier2.
    What is your opinion?

  75. Lucian jungle/top lane is kinda OP too many games with lucian jugnle just tearing stuff up

  76. Matthew RobinsonAugust 29, 2013

    If you guys are wanting a better and more accurate approach on what champs are good and bad then check out this tier list: It is based on stats. Nothing can be stats because they are facts and not opinions. I've quit coming here to get an insight because this tier list has bias information.

  77. why is pantheon so low on tier list for mid? every time i use him mid he can crush any mage that is in his lane

  78. i asked the same thing i think he is a great mid

  79. Olaf isnt as bad as you make him out to be...

  80. Yorick isnt tier 1 imo, more like tier 2.

  81. SSJSuntasticAugust 29, 2013

    Hi joshua honestly she's really close and can easily be in god tier. The only thing that's keeping her at the top of tier one is the speed is her ccs. On the other hand if you can land them consistently regardless there's no reason why she shouldn't be god tier. Nami is tier 1 at an average level of play against similar skilled players.

  82. SSJSuntasticAugust 29, 2013

    I find Nautilus is rarely played as a support, so it's hard to get an opinion on him. That being said, I think he's good as a kill lane, but is a poor support unless you get jungler support since he has no sustain or poke.

  83. J4 is at his STRONGEST late game he can go full tank and still hurt. Or you can go health+damage items like Mallet, Clea an deal so much damage and not be hurt. He's my favorite my win rate is ridiculous

  84. I have no idea about mid, as Pantheon is my most favorited champs, but i suck in mid, so i cant tell^^
    But Pantheon on Top and in Jungle, depending on your teamcomp, he can be a lane destroyer. On a CC-heavy team (preferably Blitzcrank (everyone with stun/cc)), he can excell also because of his high movement speed (with 4,5% MS Quints) he can chase nearly any enemy down, even after he flashed (except teemo... damn, i hate teemo!)

  85. Phreaking PandaAugust 30, 2013

    Olaf has the lowest win ratio in the game. Js.

  86. Phreaking PandaAugust 30, 2013

    Likely because Pantheon is very hit or miss. If he doesn't get fed he's damn near useless.

  87. Phreaking PandaAugust 30, 2013

    I've actually seen more Nautilus supports in the last week than I have the entire time I have played League. For some reason, it's getting popular. Must be the Koreans.

  88. Phreaking PandaAugust 30, 2013

    There's only one problem with Kha'Zix, to be honest. He has almost nothing to offer lategame besides an assassination on the AD or AP carry and if they have a GA, it was useless. Sure, he can 1v1 almost anyone earlygame but lategame he lacks the damage of Master Yi and the tankiness/utility of all the other popular junglers.

  89. Phreaking PandaAugust 30, 2013

    A good Yorick can 1v5 bruh. Even then, his ultimate can revive your AD carry and for a short time beforehand, make two of them. If you have a Vayne, this spells instant death for the enemy team.

  90. Agree with you but dangerous pick if the people you are playing with aren't aware how it works...(It happens)

  91. I honestly feel Talon should be a bit higher at least. I mean yes if he relies on getting a last whisper early on a bit heavily and can be outranged. But his burst damage is massive and lately when I've been playing him he usually ends up with 30 kills by the end of the game.

  92. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Talons pretty good 1v1 but as you mentioned he relies heavily on getting lw, and Armor items are well priced right now. This also puts high pressure on your adc to get Arpen, especially if talon is the fed one on your team. That being said, I do like him!

  93. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Jarvans definitely a beast!

  94. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Hey anonagon, I would but they usually vary somewhat. I may just do an large explanation page soon and add updated explanations I go. Thanks for the idea! Are there any in particular you want to know about?

  95. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    No problem, the description is somewhat hidden. No need to be sorry :)

  96. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Thanks for helping out mr spade!

  97. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Hi julien, I've actually seen it before as I have a friend who mains it. It's definitely strong, but hard to place since since it's highly player dependant.

  98. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    His cc and damage are still extremely good, and so is his win rate. He's just got a very game changing skillset, so I think he still deserves his good tier spot :)

  99. Alleria WindrunnerAugust 30, 2013

    This. I've been playing Quinn top a lot recently, and it definitely is viable.

  100. Meh :/ you ignore the most important > getting rebooted & not easy ult sometimes...

  101. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    Jarvan IV and Zac, if you can get them on the same team, is probably the strongest team fight potential in the entire game. It doesn’t even really matter who jungles or who lanes. Any professional team currently who is able to draft both of these guys to the same team will always do so. They are both insanely strong. Jarvan IV just has no weaknesses. He does decent damage with no damage items, he has great utility, he can engage on anyone, anywhere, at any time.

  102. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    I'm guessing you're naming the best junglers. You forget to mention Sejuani, Nautilus, and Hecarim.

  103. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    Fiddlesticks probably deserves better than Tier 4, but he is here because people often take him into sub-optimal situations. He has the flexibility to play jungle, support, or even (for some brave souls) mid-lane; but putting him on a team requires someone else on the team to play a tank, and if your support or top laner isn’t an extremely tanky initiator who can compensate for you building a full power AP jungler then you will lose come team-fight phase. He has the worst KDA in the game for a jungler, and it’s because of the selfish players who take him into team composition he does not fit in. If you can safely pick Fiddlesticks into a team who can tank for you, well then you will be caw-cawing your way to victory.

  104. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    Wukong in Mid lane is very situational. He's better off at top lane bro.

  105. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    He draws a lot of bad players and actually require a great deal of skill to play well. He also requires more farm than is usually possible in the jungle. He can’t get by on the same jungle starved budget as champions in Tier 2.

  106. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    He's not the best Jungler but he does deserve God tier.

  107. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    Talon is a situational/niche pick for top lane. I wouldn't pick him against Zac. You'd get raped.

  108. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    I agree. Yorick has had a bit of resurgence in popularity in the pro scene, he is a pick that really enables your AD Carry to have great support from the top lane. Yorick is pure annoyance to lane against and his ultimate can reverse a lost team fight single-handedly. Riot has already said they are going to be trashing his whole kit and giving him a new one.

  109. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    Riot has noted how bad Olaf is and all he needs is some work as far as balance goes, so we may see some positive changes for this champion soon since I've been seeing some positive things from it on the PBE.

  110. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    Pantheon mid can be a scary pick if you want to unleash manly air-drops on side lane ganks, but there are a lot more reliable choices than him generally, and he gets beat in lane pretty bad by hard pushers who prevent him from roaming.

  111. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    Lucian hasn't been out long enough for us to make an accurate judgement call on how well or bad he is in the game.

  112. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    He requires way too much item gold to scale to be reliably successful as a jungler. You would pretty much always be better served picking one of the free stats bruiser beasts over Kha'Zix. There are other AD champions who have both much better early and late games out of the jungle than him.

  113. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    He deserves to be there. Pantheon mid can be a scary pick if you want to unleash manly air-drops on side lane ganks, but there are a lot more reliable choices than him generally, and he gets beat in lane pretty bad by hard pushers who prevent him from roaming.

  114. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    I would have to agree. Jarvan IV and Zac, if you can get them on the same team, is probably the strongest team fight potential in the entire game. It doesn’t even really matter who jungles or who lanes. Any professional team currently who is able to draft both of these guys to the same team will always do so. They are both insanely strong. Jarvan IV just has no weaknesses. He does decent damage with no damage items, he has great utility, he can engage on anyone, anywhere, at any time. This tier list is based on opinions and is bias so only take it with a grain of salt.

  115. Matthew RobinsonAugust 30, 2013

    Nautilus is a situational/niche pick bro. Janna is just a better support than him.

  116. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    I think ranged top laners are definitely viable with the right team composition, and I've seen all sorts of mobile ADC do well. It's just hard to place them since they're a very niche set.

  117. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Hey Matthew, it's true that your own team composition matters a lot when picking Fiddle, but I think that selecting Fiddle to compensate for the enemy team composition matters greatly as well. If you're against a team with high mobility and strong disengage, then he becomes lacking.

    However, against an all-in team that has only one method of engaging (i.e. Ashe Arrow or Blitz hook), then I think he's extremely strong since the enemy team is always afraid of initiating even when their initiation seems successful (i.e. landing a spell).

    In regards to his KDA it's generally because he is still squishy, and for every death he gets he'll need a lot to regain KDA (which is why statistics aren't the most reliable method of making a tier list.)

    The way fiddle operates, it really only takes one good teamfight to win a game, which is always possible when fiddle's in play.

  118. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Nautilus is very close to Jarvan in terms of utility, but the fact that Jarvan can engage from a distance of 3 Flashes away and potentially hit two AOE knockups in the same teamfight I'd say gives him more utility.

    Meanwhile, with the way Nautilus' ult works (while very strong) champions with a gap closer have the ability to gain some safe ground before it CCs them.

  119. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    In terms of CC and disruption it's true that they're both very strong. However, I don't think that they're overpowered just because of the utility they provide, so with a few number tweaks they could easily be brought into line with other junglers.

  120. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Nocturne can't carry quite as hard as Tier 1 junglers right now simply because of the way the game's balanced. He still offers good utility and engagement potential though, so with the right follow-up he's still very strong.

    Keep in mind that Tier 2 is the balanced tier. Nothing's wrong with these champions.

  121. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Yorick might not have the damage to carry a game by himself, but his laning phase is extremely safe, if not overbearing, his mid-game utility is high as he doesn't need to facecheck bushes, and his late game obviously offers a lot in the way of his ultimate.

  122. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    I'm glad you at least half agree :P

  123. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Pantheon's strong early, but if he doesn't pick up kills he falls off fast. Even if he does get many kills, he still falls off slowly by late game. He also promotes building armor on the enemy team, which spells trouble for your ADC.

  124. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    I try my best Matt! I'm glad you appreciate it ;)

  125. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    He might be good at ganking, but in terms of objectives it's a bit of a gamble...

  126. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    Zac will likely be moved to God Tier top next update if he doesn't get nerfed again.

  127. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    I don't think he's THAT bad, he has decent damage output.

  128. SSJSuntasticAugust 30, 2013

    I think people just need to get used to his new ranges. His late game is still beastmode. Cassio definitely needs another look as other champions have been nerfed hard though.

  129. Vi Top lane?

  130. Sure, he is not the best, I just wanted to say that imo he is better than the other ones in tier3.
    Anyway, it is only my opinion, thanks for sharing yours, mate :)

  131. Well, then maybe it is only my opinion, that he is better than the other ones in tier3.
    Thanks for your reply!

  132. Oh, I forgot

    Hecarim > Yi

    Heck, Hec should be a jungle god. He's so fast, lol. He doesn't have much CC, but he does have such an impact on the games he plays because of his god-speeds.

    also, still think Fiora should go to Tier 2 or 1. :P

  133. what are your thoughts on swain? (im thinking of getting him)

  134. Matthew RobinsonAugust 31, 2013

    A Blitzcrank negates Fiddlesticks because he has hard CC and the same goes for an Ashe arrow for when Fiddlesticks is charging his ult.. Any type of hard CC counters Fiddlesticks when he's draining with his W or charging up his ult. Janna also can use her ult to push him off of teammates. He is strong but he is only strong if you have the right team comp and your bias tier list is wrong which is why I don't use it anymore as I have found one that is based on facts and stats than your bias opinions. Fiddlestick has the worst early level jungling in the game and an enemy jungler can just go to his red at level 3 or 2 and rape him in a 1v1 which is why I always ward my red at 1:30. Statistics are the most reliable method of making tier lists and it's what Riot uses to make buffs and nerfs. You can't argue with the facts that statistics bring but I can argue with you about your opinions and win every time by supplying the statistics.

  135. Matthew RobinsonAugust 31, 2013

    You're fucking retarded. Do you even fucking watch tournaments? Do you even talk to Riot employees on the PBE? It is a fact that Jarvan IV is the best jungler in the game and Zac is the best top laner in the game. They don't need tweaks because they are the best. Like I said, statistics don't lie as they are the most reliable form of info.

  136. Matthew RobinsonAugust 31, 2013

    Jarvan IV isn't very good as a top laner since that's a niche pick for him. The recent nerfs to him where to hit his laning phase.

  137. Matthew RobinsonAugust 31, 2013

    I can give you a better tier list to use since this one is bias. This one is based on opinions and not statistics.

  138. SSJSuntasticAugust 31, 2013

    Honestly I don't appreciate you're choice of words matthew and you also misunderstood me. I meant that yes they are incredibly strong, but if they were nerfed on a numbers only basis, it would balance them.

  139. SSJSuntasticAugust 31, 2013

    Matt, you have some good opinions and contribute a lot to the discussion, but if you like that list better please feel free to leave and only post on that one. Thanks!

  140. SweaterKittensAugust 31, 2013

    SSJ, I'm curious about Olaf's placement at the bottom of the barrel, in both Jungle and Toplane. I don't see him much anymore, but his potential to build fulltank and do carry-like damage is absurd. His engage boils down to running into the enemy team with Ragnarok up, and it forces a decision to focus him, and get chewed up by the carries, or focus the carries, and get chewed up by him. He may not be an incredibly high tier jungle, but I believe his potential is enormous. What is the justification for having him placed as one of the worst junglers in the game?
    - SweaterKittens

  141. SSJSuntasticAugust 31, 2013

    Hey SweaterKittens, Olaf's placement is really just a matter of win rate at the moment, as he's been dead last by quite a margin for a while, I think it's really just a matter of the fact that the "chewed up by the carries" part doesn't really occur in the time it takes for Olaf to die to ranged fire,

    That being said, I do know some people who have had great success with him, but it's a rare thing to see. If you like his playstyle I think he could be viable, but it requires a lot of outplaying and intelligent decision-making.

  142. Sn1p3rL0rdAugust 31, 2013

    Hey guys, is hecarim or zac better at jungling atm. i got j4 but it seems hes always banned, so i need a good solid jungling that won't get insta banned

  143. SSJSuntasticAugust 31, 2013

    Zac is banned a lot as well. I'd say Zac is stronger overall, but you should pick which one depending on what your team has. If your team is AD heavy, pick Zac for some AP damage, and if your team is AP heavy, pick Hecarim for some AD damage.

  144. Matthew RobinsonAugust 31, 2013

    I misunderstood you? You said: "I don't think that they're overpowered just because of the utility they provide." The utility of the ults that they use is overpowered and can't be countered. The will always win a team fight unless the team of Zac, Jarvan IV, the ADC, support, and Mid feed them to where they do more damage than their op team fighting. You're contradicting yourself bro. You say that they are strong yet you say that aren't op. Can you even make up your mind?

  145. Matthew RobinsonAugust 31, 2013

    I'm only here to provide better info to the uneducated people who come here.

  146. SSJSuntasticAugust 31, 2013

    And I do appreciate that, but your attitude comes off as very derogatory in all respects....there's a difference between being helpful and flat out bashing.

  147. SweaterKittensSeptember 01, 2013

    Thanks mate, I appreciate the thought-out response. After playing him a bit more, I've noticed that he is lacking in a lot of areas that more recent bruiser champs have in leaps and bounds. He has no strong gap closer, and although his damage output is absurd, it does require a lengthy stay in combat, and as a team initiator he just doesn't have the same disruption as someone like Sejuani.
    Thank you for putting up such an excellent tier list, I use this as my jumping off point for solo queue, and it has helped me quite a bit.


  148. SweaterKittensSeptember 01, 2013

    According to the tier list, Zac, although I find them to fill different niches. Hecarim is much more of a damage dealer; less cc, more disruption. Zac is better off building full tank, and just sustaining throughout most fights. Hec has better overall mobility, and Zac has a long range engage. Hec is primarily AD while Zac is AP. I personally prefer Hecarim, but I honestly think it comes down to whoever you click with better, and whoever works best with the team comp your given.

  149. ParadoxicideSeptember 01, 2013

    Can we get Wukong in the jungle category?

  150. Olaf feels a lot better than tier 4 top, if you can hit undertow you win most matchups. He also has very strong disengage with his ult, if your team doesn't follow up well.

  151. Ziggs Tier 3 again?

  152. I haz a question . Out of all the God Tier Junglers, which is the best? I know amumu is , but i feel rammus can be like the best or the second too.

  153. Yes you did misunderstand. He stated that they are not overpowered JUST because of the utility they provide implying that, Yes they are overpowered but they aren't overpowered just because of their utility.

    You seem mad for no reason...

  154. Have you seen Vapora's build for Talon? Basically penetrating all that armour. 68% ArPen with Weapon Expertise, Last Whisper and Black Cleaver and then an additional 30 ArPen from Black Cleaver and Youmuu's Ghostblade. Search up Talon Build on google and you will see.

  155. A good Lux would never waste a Q and they rarely miss it. Also Lux can push well via her E, Lissandra's Q also ends up u pushing the lane unintentionally if shot through melee minions. Also provoking Lux' Q isn't worth it because 1. Most likely you'd scare her with your E and your E has a far longer cool down than Lux' snare rendering you vulnerable to the enemy jungle since u just wasted your E

  156. Why is Tryndamere in tier 4 jungle? He can pull off impressive tower dives and has a quick jungle speed. Justification please?

  157. SSJSuntasticSeptember 01, 2013

    Hi Mysterious, it's mostly because Tryndamere's major strengths are in his 1v1 fighting, split pushing, and sustaining abilities. In the jungle, in order to clear faster 1~5, he also needs to use his escape to clear creeps, which leaves him vulnerable; although his W can warn him if any enemies are near.

    However, the major reason that Tryndamere in the jungle isn't nearly as good as Tryndamere top is because he's a highly gold reliant jungler with low CC, which means his success rate in this position is much lower than placing him top lane.

  158. SSJSuntasticSeptember 01, 2013

    There's not really a "best" per say. It all depends on the team compositions on both sides and how good the player is.

    I will say that Rammus is by far the most annoying, Amumu always makes me smile when he's on my team, and Jarvan/Zac/Fiddle has potential is the highest though.

  159. SSJSuntasticSeptember 01, 2013

    Jungle Wukong's a very niche role. He's kind of like an alternative form of Shaco with weaker early game and stronger late game potential. I like him, but I'm not so sure about his early jungle since if he's counterjungled at red, he provides no CC in his ganks.

  160. Quinn top can be gross. She's not unstoppable, but the Harrier-AA-Vault-AA combo can chunk off even the sturdiest of top laners, taking off globs of HP for 50 hp. It's also, more importantly, ridiculously fun to do. Quinn is one of the most fun adc to play in the game, and it's a shame she isn't appreciated due to her split personality kit.

  161. Quinn top can be grossly entertaining. She's not unstoppable, but the
    Harrier-AA-Vault-AA combo can chunk off even the sturdiest of top
    laners, taking off globs of HP for 50 hp. It's also, more importantly,
    ridiculously fun to do. Quinn is one of the most fun adc to play in the
    game, and it's a shame she isn't appreciated due to her split
    personality kit.

  162. Matthew RobinsonSeptember 01, 2013

    You could just copy the tier list that is better than yours but add the niche/situational picks into it since that's the only different thing between yours and his. You're just disregarding the facts which are the statistics. The only thing that makes me more disappointed is people who are in denial which is why I'm bashing your opinion since it's bias.

  163. Matthew RobinsonSeptember 01, 2013

    Do you even know what utility is or means? I think you both are misunderstanding the definition of the word. Utility means support. Any type of stat can be considered as utility. For example, Wukong has high base values which bring utility to his team for an early invade. You both seem highly uneducated. Arnold Chen, you don't know me so you're wrong. I have a reason for why I'm mad and it's because of uneducated people in this world who are close minded and ignorant. I have yet to master the technique of controlling my emotions. I will eventually do that someday.

  164. Thoughts on Fiddlesticks (Jungle) from foxdrop (Jungler Diamond I EUW)

    Fiddlesticks – A very unique champion, similar to Shaco. AP junglers very rarely find their way in to a jungle meta that is dominated by bruisers, but Fiddle is always an exception. He requires a very specific play style in order to be effective that requires a lot of practice to master. He can snowball games quite hard and punishes the denizens of solo queue by exploiting their carelessness and lack of awareness. His sustain is obviously top notch due to his Drain, and he can tear teams apart with carefully constructed Ultimate positions. His Fear is one of the scariest (hah) CC abilities in the game. On the other hand, he doesn’t clear all to quickly and can be easily bullied around by certain junglers – namely anyone that can interrupt his Drain.

  165. Dude, you're absolutely wrong. Utility does not mean support. This would be utility's definition: useful, esp. through being able to perform several functions. Support would be to give assistance to or to bear all the weight of. Hardly the same thing at all. America is not home to the best LoL players out there so I don't know from where you gather your information. Watch the Allstars game between NA and Korea. NA gets CRUSHED. Do you see a J4? What about Zac in top lane? Why did Jayce get banned? What about Lee Sin? What you misunderstand is that this is a solo queue list and not a best pick for teams. Pros use less often played champs because they synergize with their team. So why do you bitch about J4 and Zac being the "best" in their respective areas when the BEST PROS don't even use them in jungle and top respectively?

  166. You really like that fiora heh ?

  167. to be honest , i think that orianna should be god mid tier or atleast tier 1 , i mean like orianna tier 2 ? thats bullshit , one of the best mids...

  168. Cyrus GivianpourSeptember 02, 2013

    link please?

  169. Andrew ScottSeptember 02, 2013

    Talon is literally countered by 95% of tops, he should be t7 top :P

  170. Why is teemo so bad...... only in tier 2...

  171. Good grief. ignore this guy SSJ. He sounds like a psychopath. So mad for a tiny thing about a game.

  172. SSJSuntasticSeptember 03, 2013

    Tier 2 isn't bad at all, it means they're balanced :)

  173. SSJSuntasticSeptember 03, 2013

    Orianna's definitely got one of the highest potentials in the game, but at the same time she's very dependent on positioning and her ult's got just enough lag time that it can fail right when you need it the most.

    I do agree that she's very strong though, which is why she's on the upper end of Tier 2.

  174. I definitely think you should add Blitzcrank as a mid laner somewhere in the list. His Q and R scale off of AP 1:1, his E can further add to his combo if he has a sheen, his ganks are AWESOME, and he brings a lot to a teamfight with his grab of death and AoE ult and silence. His early game is a bit weak much like Kassadin and he's pretty bad in lane against aggressive laners like LeBlanc, but when he gets his ult he can clear waves instantly and be a monster when he lands a grab and can combo. Anyway, give him a try mid, he's pretty bangin yo

  175. How did shen fall to tier 2? Did he get nerfed? I still see him get banned often

  176. Why is Zed a Tier 2 - mid champion? He deserves a better place in this list :D

  177. urgot at tier 4, really? tha harass power as an adc is awesome, so with support with heals are very good with him since he can harass at a huge range, not forgetting his passive that makes adc deal less damage going along with hes slighty tanky build gives him a good potencial in 2v2 , i would say that it depends a lot in the support to determine if an adc is good or not, zyra ashe is very strong...taric and graves too

  178. I'm not sure if you can read... But he did state they are very strong
    utility wise and stat wise. If they were nerfed stat wise they would be
    balanced. Instead of getting mad at other people who oppose you,
    Actually read what the person is stating.. Also acting condescending
    isn't going to help either, It just exploits how much of an immature,
    ignorant, and prideful person you are on the internet and most likely on
    a daily basis when you can't control yourself.

  179. I keep looking to buy Zyra looking at this List, but I dont see why she is so high, care to give me your thoughts?

  180. Zilean is underrated.

  181. Best Hooker EUSeptember 04, 2013

    Reading through all the posts, and the comments you've made is waay too reliant on Jarvan jungle, and zac top - What are you? Guardian of the Zac IV? - You have to realize, there is other champions than Jarvan and Zac (113 more to be exact) - Yes, Jarvan and Zac are powerful - Have you forgotten about Vlad and the crew?

    If Zac really is as OP as you make him, why do he have 47.85% win? (24th worst to be exact) ? - If you wanna bitch about statistics, why not claim that Rammus, Janna, Fiddle, Amumu and Sona are OP? They are afterall the Top5.

  182. Matthew RobinsonSeptember 04, 2013

    >implying that the word utility doesn't mean support
    >implying that the word support doesn't mean utility
    >gives both definitions which proves I'm right
    >says utility means useful
    >says support means giving assistance by being useful
    >MFW this fool contradicts himself

    >implying that educated people do not live in America
    >implying that everyone in America is dumb
    >MFW this kid just called himself dumb

    >implying that Zac and J4 are not picked by pros
    >implying that I was talking about arranged teams when referring to the statistics
    >implying that pros only use less often played champs
    >implying that I'm bitching
    >implying that J4 and Zac are not the best champs in there areas when the statistics prove otherwise
    >MFW this kid is still replying

  183. Nicolas CageSeptember 04, 2013

    Great CC, works well as both a mid and a support (with quite a few ADCs), can do respectable damage with just a Liandry's, etc...

    She's a worthwhile buy.

  184. Matthew RobinsonSeptember 04, 2013

    >implying that he said they were strong utility wise
    >"I don't think that they're overpowered just because of the utility they provide"
    >MFW this idiot doesn't fucking know how to read

    >implying that I'm getting mad
    >implying that I need to actually read what a person is stating when he doesn't even do that himself
    >implying that trolls are immature and ignorant
    >MFW this kid is straight mad

  185. Matthew RobinsonSeptember 04, 2013

    >implying that I'm mad for a tiny thing about a gam
    >MFW this kid thinks he knows everything about me and must be the all knowing wizard of the universe

  186. Matthew RobinsonSeptember 04, 2013

    >implying that I'm trying to make him seem OP
    >implying that win% is the only thing that matters when determining if a champ is OP
    >implying that I'm bitching about statistics
    >MFW this kid doesn't know what he's talking about

    I'll just leave this here for you faggot and let it seep into your soul for a bit.

  187. Matthew RobinsonSeptember 04, 2013

    I would have to agree which is why I said he's a niche/situational pick for top lane.

  188. SSJ can you make a 3.11 tier list please? it just got out and i really want to know it :D
    thanks in advance

  189. He cannot make a tier list out of a version which is only out for 24h...
    Give him some times to see the impact In Game first!
    Second, this list is still quiet accurate atm.

  190. Ain't viable in most comp setup :/

  191. Must wait for some rework :)

  192. He is not underrated its not because you won 1 or 2 games with this champ that he must be God Tier...
    See the difference between underrated & unviable due to skillset...
    (In the same category as Heimerdinger Sion etc...)

  193. To SSJ >

    Fiddlesticks has become more common as a support pick than as a jungle pick. As a jungle pick he’s got a real feast-or-famine all-in vibe to him and you either feel like the king of the map or get completely destroyed playing him. I think as far as reliability and overall impact it is probably safer to play him as a support now, but he’s still played in the jungle enough that he’s worth mentioning.

    Verified on Lolking less thank 45% of fiddlesticks are played in jungle for 9% of popularity...

  194. Swain must be tier 1 with ap tanky build.

  195. Wukong mid?

  196. I think you are the only one that consider amumu and rammus god tier.
    They can be punished hard early on, if you get their first blue you
    practically won the jungling game.
    As for rammus, his clear time is
    aweful , and the meta is shifting toward xj9/meteos style in which
    rammus can simply not exist because he can't clear a camp fast enough to
    be efficient. If you face a nocturne who is farming and only ganking
    when his ult is up he will end up with 5k gold more than you...

  197. disqus_YxCy6fZexrSeptember 05, 2013

    Thresh really needs to be on at least T2 ADC.

    Try him out. He's really tanky due to his armor and building mercury's treads makes you less vulnerable to ap because of the magic resist and tenacity. (CC usually comes from ap)

  198. Any thoughts on Sion being placed in the top lane? I play him with 9/21/0 masteries, taking the cooldown reduction up to the magic penetration in offense and the normal defense route. For runes I run Hybrid-pen reds, scaling hp seals, scaling ap glyphs, and MS quints. Although I run an AP setup, I build flat AD. My build always consists of Ravenous Hydra, Berserker's Greaves, and some form of Armor pen (Last Whisper or Black cleaver, although I haven't tried Youmuu's Ghotsblade yet) and the rest is situational. I max my E, and freeze the lane just outside tower, farming my health up. In the past 5 games with him, my bonus health has capped out at +800. His skill set seems nearly designed for solo queue success. The stun wins almost any engagement vs most top laners. His shield can be used to block damage, clear waves, or as a bonus damage during duels. His e gives him an unlimited amount of hp, and an extra 65 damage every attack if on. His Ult heals himself, and his team just for fighting, allowing any fight to be turned around. Yesterday, I played as him, and got caught out in a 4 man gank. Instead of running, i decided to fight seeing that my team was coming. The fight was over before my team showed up. I ended up killing 3 of the 4 people, while Cho'gath flashed the wall and ran, I ended up surviving with almost full hp after it was over. You might want to give him a look. He is very strong in lower-tier games. I would place him between the high 3's or mediums 2's. Thanks for reading.


Feel free to comment or leave a message :)